Curse

DarkSpirit · Aug 26, 2008, 07:06 AM // 07:06

Quote:

Originally Posted by Paul Dawg

We're talking about HEROES. I don't care if they can use [dismiss condition] on themselves. For what I want heroes to do, [mend condition] works better because it cures and its recharge time is less.

Dismiss can be used as a heal other than for condition removal but heroes dont know that. It is also better on specialized builds with enchantments like on a bonder or orders.

Like Tyla said, mend conditions doesn't work on the monk himself and you want to protect your monk. It would work if you have more than 1 monk with mend conditions on your team, otherwise not being able to remove conditions from your monk is still a disadvantage.

Quote:

And what areas are you talking about? If it's Shards of Orr, OK, then one necro's Foul Feast isn't going to be enough. If it's just about any other zone, it probably will be.

Foul Feast alone doesn't remove conditions from that necro, you usually need to bring another condition removing skill with it.

Quote:

I guess you didn't read what I said. Again, we're talking about HEROES. And the problem is that heroes don't know which hexes need to be taken off and which don't. They're hopeless at it. If you're in a "hex area," [cure hex] isn't even going to make much of a difference because of its twelve-second recharge time. If removing hexes is really your top priority, you need to load them with a different skill.

People who bring Cure Hex, bring it not just for the hex removal but also the spike heal that comes with it. In a hex heavy area, I agree that one cure hex would not be enough but you can always bring more than one hex removal skill then. Hex removal skills are still important in some pve areas.

distilledwill · Aug 26, 2008, 08:56 AM // 08:56

[Word of Healing] is the bees knees when it comes to healing. I use this build:

[build prof=Mo/E box divine=9+1 prot=9+1 Heal=12+1+1][Word Of Healing][Patient Spirit][Cure Hex][Guardian][Shield Of Absorption][Dismiss Condition][Glyph Of Lesser Energy][Divine Spirit][/build]

Ive been trying out the new aura of faith as a substitute and I kinda like it, mainly cus I like trying out new elites. This is what Ive been using:

[build prof=Mo/E box divine=9+1 heal=9+1 prot=12+1+1][Aura of Faith][Signet Of Rejuvenation][Dwayna's Kiss][Aegis][Dismiss Condition][Cure Hex][Glyph Of Lesser][Divine Spirit][/build]

Not had toooooo much of a chance to try it out but it seems to work ok, I like it with a [[Dwayna's Sorrow] Minion Bomber as they provide small heals often and will often trigger the greatly increased healing from [[Aura Of Faith]. (Bear in mind that the BBcode isnt updated for Aura of Faith.)

Edit: Just realised you don't have EotN, so replace [[Cure Hex] with [[Remove Hex], [[Deny Hexes] or [[Reverse Hex].

Paul Dawg · Aug 26, 2008, 08:45 PM // 20:45

DarkSpirit--really, some of this is laughable.

First, if your [foul feast] necro is a curses necro, he can immediately send out all his conditions via [plague touch] or [plague sending]. So he might not even need anyone to remove his conditions. But if you really want your hero monk to relieve him of all his conditions, that's all the MORE reason to use [mend condition] over [dismiss condition]. Frankly, only in very unusual areas, such as Shards of Orr, is a necro with [foul feast] inadequate for condition-removal. (And it's not as though [dismiss condition] is going to be adequate in Shards of Orr either.)

Second, are you serious that you want your heroes to use [cure hex] for spike healing? It has a twelve-second recharge. That's not a very efficient skill for healing. It's a great skill in the hands of a HUMAN. On a hero's bar, it leaves a lot to be desired.

The whole point is that you have to think about what HEROES do well and not so well, and you have to think about how their bar is going to mesh with the rest of your party's. You can't just say, "Oh, the best hero monk build is in Point 8 of So-and-so's guide." That's teaching people how NOT to play Guild Wars.

Tyla · Aug 26, 2008, 09:27 PM // 21:27

Quote:

Originally Posted by Paul Dawg

We're talking about HEROES. I don't care if they can use [dismiss condition] on themselves. For what I want heroes to do, [mend condition] works better because it cures and its recharge time is less.

HOLY CRAP ONE SECOND!

Oh, and I know we're talking about heroes. Sorry, but being able to remove conditions off yourself is also good.

Quote:

And what areas are you talking about? If it's Shards of Orr, OK, then one necro's [foul feast] isn't going to be enough. If it's just about any other zone, it probably will be.

If it's Shards of Orr I would probably be running Sight Beyond Sight if my physicals have a secondary open. That is, if I'm not running some dodgy smiting build.

Quote:

I guess you didn't read what I said. Again, we're talking about HEROES. And the problem is that heroes don't know which hexes need to be taken off and which don't. They're hopeless at it. If you're in a "hex area," [cure hex] isn't even going to make much of a difference because of its twelve-second recharge time. If removing hexes is really your top priority, you need to load them with a different skill.

Newsflash: You can micro. Oh, and if hexes are really that dangerous and spammy and can easily be covered, I would probably be using Expel...

@Distilled:

I've been using the new Aura of Faith lately as a player and I must say it's pretty strong. You can even turn Dismiss into a friggin' powerheal.

How do heroes manage with it?

DarkSpirit · Aug 27, 2008, 12:19 AM // 00:19

Quote:

Originally Posted by Paul Dawg

DarkSpirit--really, some of this is laughable.

First, if your [foul feast] necro is a curses necro, he can immediately send out all his conditions via [plague touch] or [plague sending]. So he might not even need anyone to remove his conditions. But if you really want your hero monk to relieve him of all his conditions, that's all the MORE reason to use [mend condition] over [dismiss condition]. Frankly, only in very unusual areas, such as Shards of Orr, is a necro with [foul feast] inadequate for condition-removal. (And it's not as though [dismiss condition] is going to be adequate in Shards of Orr either.)

And what do you call plague touch and plague sending? That's right, they are essentially condition removing skills, even though they are special condition removing skills since they only remove conditions from the necro. And what did I say?

Quote:

Originally Posted by DarkSpirit

Foul Feast alone doesn't remove conditions from that necro, you usually need to bring another condition removing skill with it.

So you have just proven my point.

Quote:

Second, are you serious that you want your heroes to use [cure hex] for spike healing? It has a twelve-second recharge. That's not a very efficient skill for healing. It's a great skill in the hands of a HUMAN. On a hero's bar, it leaves a lot to be desired.

The whole point is that you have to think about what HEROES do well and not so well, and you have to think about how their bar is going to mesh with the rest of your party's. You can't just say, "Oh, the best hero monk build is in Point 8 of So-and-so's guide." That's teaching people how NOT to play Guild Wars.

Cure Hex doesn't spike heal unless it removes a hex, so heroes use it correctly as a hex removal skill. Check out the description on wiki:

Remove one Hex from target ally. If a Hex was removed, that ally is healed for 30...102...120 Health.

http://wiki.guildwars.com/wiki/Cure_Hex

The heal is just an after-effect. Whether heroes know it or not doesn't matter since you still get the heal from the way that they are using it to remove hexes.

distilledwill · Aug 27, 2008, 08:44 AM // 08:44

Quote:

Originally Posted by Tyla

@Distilled:

I've been using the new Aura of Faith lately as a player and I must say it's pretty strong. You can even turn Dismiss into a friggin' powerheal.

How do heroes manage with it?

Pretty well, with the new hero AI where they pre-prot much better they seem to stick on before the damage hits, which helps a tonne. The only problem is the short span. It is much better in the hands of a human who knows where the BIIIIG dommmage is coming from whereas heroes sometimes use it when its a little bit overkill. As I say, not much chance to try it all, I always use discord now and only use monks on the lower level characters without the necro trio, ill probably test it a bit more tonight.

Having said that with a 20/20 +20% enchant staff its pretty efficient. I would stick [[Gift Of Health] in there instead of the heals and replace all the other heals with prots but I love [[Cure Hex] too damn much. **HIDES FROM CURRENT FLAMEWAR**

Nainoa · Aug 27, 2008, 04:28 PM // 16:28

Jesus Christ! How hard is it to develop your own build for the mobs you're up against and test it out on a hero? If you're failing with pvx builds and don't know why chances are you suck at this game anyway. Any build posted here isn't going to help you. Learn to play. Read skill descriptions being mindful of recharges, energy costs, and casting times. Choose skills that are appropriate for your goal, the enemies you will be facing, and synergize with your team. Experiment with the build and tweak it as necessary. I swear most GW players are either too stupid (most likely) or too lazy to make their own builds.

Edit: lol Darkspirit in another useless GW argument on the Internet.

someone3426 · Aug 29, 2008, 08:34 PM // 20:34

Quote:

Originally Posted by Nainoa

Jesus Christ! How hard is it to develop your own build for the mobs you're up against and test it out on a hero? If you're failing with pvx builds and don't know why chances are you suck at this game anyway. Any build posted here isn't going to help you. Learn to play. Read skill descriptions being mindful of recharges, energy costs, and casting times. Choose skills that are appropriate for your goal, the enemies you will be facing, and synergize with your team. Experiment with the build and tweak it as necessary. I swear most GW players are either too stupid (most likely) or too lazy to make their own builds.

You see, I'm not too stupid nor too lazy to make a build, it's just I wanted to get others' input to see what is tried and true, and what fails. I read all of these posts, and I think I am getting the hang of it. I gave my heroes a build I made, and am tweaking it where I see necessary.